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i'm very pleased to introduce mick west

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who um

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was an erstwhile video game developer

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and

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has devoted i guess the last decade or

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so to

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popularizing scientific thinking and

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fighting conspiracy theories and so on

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he's the

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author of a a very well received book

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on fighting conspiracy theories down the

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rabbit hole which he held up to me

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yeah yeah okay sorry so we can know that

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that actually exists

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uh he um is has worked

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uh to a large extent on trying to debunk

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chemtrails

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which if if you haven't even heard of

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those you should go look up what that is

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and you'll discover things by mick um

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and latterly the pentagon i guess

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released a bunch of ufo videos which

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caused a big

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big splash people claiming that they

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were released secretly during the

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pandemic so nobody would notice or

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something

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but actually lots of people did notice

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and uh mick spent some time trying to

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explain why

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why uh there are rational explanations

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for these videos and that's

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that's what he's going to talk about to

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us today so take it away mick

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all right thank you very much douglas

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and yeah i'm going to

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get to the videos very quickly uh first

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of all i'm just going to give you a bit

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more specific background as to who i am

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and why i

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am well suited to doing this uh

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i am a video game programmer which you

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might think isn't particularly useful

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retired video game programmer and in

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1999 i did tony hawk's pro skater which

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is a very popular game at the time

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but doing video games you have to be

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experts in a bunch of things one of the

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one of which is like 3d graphics

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figuring out where things are in 3d

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space

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and coding up uh solutions for 3d

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problems how to get something from here

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to there what something looks like from

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a certain position

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in 2006 after i retired from the video

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game industry

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i started a website called contrail

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science which was

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uh looking into the uh the chemtrails

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conspiracy theory

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and i kind of became an expert in uh in

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contrails and identifying aircraft

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because a lot of the time people will

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see strange aircraft in the sky and

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think it was some kind of government

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plot

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and so i would uh figure out what it was

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uh looking it up on flight rider 24

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usually

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in 2010 i founded metabunk which is a

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more general

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investigating and debunking site and

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there i gained a whole bunch of skills

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in debunking conspiracy theories

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and uh analyzing ufo videos using all of

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the

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previous skills that i have just

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outlined 3d graphics

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tracking down planes things like that

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all right

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so these u.s navy ufo videos

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let's have a look at some historical

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context i'm going to do this in reverse

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so we're going to start out in present

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day and we'll go back to where they

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actually came from which

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it wasn't actually during the pandemic

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it was sometime

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quite quite a long time before the

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pandemic so

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the most recent thing was that in uh

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august 20

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2020 the department of defense announced

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they've established a uap

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task force to study uaps

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now uaps are really the same thing as

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ufos

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a u u a p is a

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unidentified aerial phenomenon and a ufo

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is an unidentified flying object

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and i guess the phenomenon thing

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encompasses things like lights in the

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sky which might not actually be objects

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for example

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venus even though it's an object it's

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really

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for most people just a light in the sky

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it's not actually flying through the

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atmosphere it's

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a light from some heavenly body far away

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so it's more all-encompassing

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and it kind of loses a bit of the stigma

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of ufo which people think of being

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a kind of x-files type thing

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[Music]

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so uaps their terms will be used

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interchangeably here

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april 27 2020 and this is what we're

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really talking about the videos were

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released and

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uh even says release right there now

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they released these three videos but

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what actually happened was

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the videos were already out there and it

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says that here in

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uh in the the release that they were

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actually

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have been circulating in the public

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domain after unauthorized releases in

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2007 and 2017. so

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nothing at all to do with the pandemic

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they came out in 2017

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or one of them actually came out in

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2007.

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so those three uh us navy videos are

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called fleur one

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gimbal and go fast three uh similar

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looking but very different videos and

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i'm gonna go

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over each one of them

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uh first of all like the the release of

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these videos created enormous amount of

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media attention and i think this is kind

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of

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muddied the water because people uh

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presented these videos as being

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something

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has admitted is real

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and it's like it's uh it's you know it's

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it's disclosure into the ufo uh

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community term

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people think that the government has

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finally admitted that ufos are real but

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they haven't really they've just

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released these three videos

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uh the most recent of the three videos

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came out back in march 2018 this was the

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go fast video it was in the the

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washington post thus

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it was actually released by an

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organization called the to the stars

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academy

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interesting organization it's actually

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run by

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tom delong and if you don't know who tom

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delong

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is he is the lead singer and guitarist

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for blink 182 which is a uh

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pop group uh from you know

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a decade ago or so so he's running this

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organization with his millions of

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dollars that he made in the music

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industry and he's trying to

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bring ufos to public knowledge

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fascinating story but not what we're

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talking about here exactly

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the real start of this is in december

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2017 when the new york times

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published this story that said glowing

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auras and black money

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the pentagon's mysterious ufo program

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and they released the other two videos

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the one called flare one

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and the other one called gimbal and

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they they made a big deal of it they

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said it was uh

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you know a revelation that the pentagon

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was investigating ufos and the pentagon

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had these

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these official videos yeah the pentagon

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didn't really agree with them on this

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because they

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didn't actually officially release them

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then the official release came later but

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essentially they came out in december

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2017. um

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and also in december 2017 that was kind

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of the founding of the to the stars

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academy here they were kind of linked

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together

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they coordinated the release with the

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new york times so tom de long was

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promoting this whole thing so that's

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where these videos came from

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the first video actually came out in

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2007 in the above top secret forum which

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is a kind of conspiracy

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oriented website uh from back in the day

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uh yeah a really really long time ago

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this has been running

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and uh it links to the video and the

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link actually still works if you use the

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archive.org link

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the uh way back machine that video is

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still there it was actually released in

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2007

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it's the same video as it is today it

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didn't get much attention back then

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because people thought it was fake but

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now people

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know that it's real it's a real navy

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video it gets a lot more attention

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okay so before i get to those two videos

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i'm going to have a quick look at two

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older cases that share some of the same

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features

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and they're quite illustrative in how

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how we should look at cases like this

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one of them is the 2010 mystery missile

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case over los angeles

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and the other one is the 2017 chilean

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navy ufo

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case 2010 mystery missile this is a big

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deal

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back in 2010 you may remember it if you

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were old enough

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and uh someone fired a missile

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over los angeles nobody knew what it was

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the military

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didn't know what it was and they said it

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wasn't them and they didn't know what it

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was they thought it was 35 miles off the

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coast of los

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angeles and people were suspecting it

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was the chinese doing a show of force

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very dramatic looking uh footage there

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of the what looks like a missile

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the media likes to have experts so they

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went out and found a couple of experts

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they found robert ellsworth the former

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deputy secretary of defense and tom

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mcinery

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a general and former fighter pilot and

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both of them said it is a

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a missile and the general in fact was

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100 certainly he said he'd flown

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hundreds of combat missions

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and he knew exactly what a missile

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launch looked like and this was a

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missile launch

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but he was wrong it is was not in fact a

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missile launch

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uh it was something i'd seen before

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because i'm a contrail guy i'm a

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contrail expert

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so i see all kinds of unusual contrails

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and i've seen this

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contrail uh the year before december 31

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2009

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a plane flying towards the camera over

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the horizon left a contrail

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which let looked very much like this one

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so i kind of recognized it immediately

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as a contrail

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the test then was to figure out how to

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show this to people so it's kind of long

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sure is short um

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me and another guy kind of tracks down

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what planes were coming over the horizon

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towards los angeles at that time

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we imported the into google earth

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and we plotted where they were we moved

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the viewpoint to the camera down to

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where the

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footage was taken from then we moved it

287
00:09:40,630 --> 00:09:39,200
to some guy's house because some guy had

288
00:09:42,790 --> 00:09:40,640
taken a whole bunch of photos of this

289
00:09:44,550 --> 00:09:42,800
this ufo so we found his house got the

290
00:09:47,750 --> 00:09:44,560
photos we overlaid them

291
00:09:48,949 --> 00:09:47,760
uh tracked the top of the track overlaid

292
00:09:51,829 --> 00:09:48,959
it over the radar track

293
00:09:53,509 --> 00:09:51,839
and it was a perfect match matched

294
00:09:54,710 --> 00:09:53,519
exactly with its radar track so that

295
00:09:56,870 --> 00:09:54,720
basically proved

296
00:09:59,110 --> 00:09:56,880
100 this was what it was it was just a

297
00:10:01,110 --> 00:09:59,120
plane it was leaving a contrail

298
00:10:03,590 --> 00:10:01,120
it wasn't in fact a missile so the

299
00:10:08,150 --> 00:10:03,600
general was wrong

300
00:10:13,350 --> 00:10:11,509
excuse me experts make mistakes

301
00:10:15,030 --> 00:10:13,360
even former government officials and

302
00:10:17,509 --> 00:10:15,040
fighter pilots and generals

303
00:10:19,110 --> 00:10:17,519
perspective can be very confusing

304
00:10:20,069 --> 00:10:19,120
especially when things are a long way

305
00:10:22,389 --> 00:10:20,079
away

306
00:10:24,230 --> 00:10:22,399
powerful zoom magnifies this the

307
00:10:25,829 --> 00:10:24,240
illusions of perspective perspective

308
00:10:26,710 --> 00:10:25,839
compression when you're zooming in on

309
00:10:28,949 --> 00:10:26,720
something

310
00:10:31,269 --> 00:10:28,959
uh it looks very different to when

311
00:10:33,829 --> 00:10:31,279
you're actually much closer to it so

312
00:10:35,750 --> 00:10:33,839
zoom is a confounding factor the earth

313
00:10:37,670 --> 00:10:35,760
is not flat things come over the horizon

314
00:10:39,430 --> 00:10:37,680
they don't just uh disappear over

315
00:10:41,670 --> 00:10:39,440
the the top they actually come over the

316
00:10:43,910 --> 00:10:41,680
horizon so that makes it look like it

317
00:10:47,350 --> 00:10:43,920
was flying up in the air

318
00:10:50,630 --> 00:10:47,360
small or far away small or far away is

319
00:10:53,110 --> 00:10:50,640
a common problem in ufo ology

320
00:10:54,389 --> 00:10:53,120
when people are looking at things that

321
00:10:56,150 --> 00:10:54,399
they don't know what they are

322
00:10:58,310 --> 00:10:56,160
and they don't know how big they are you

323
00:10:59,509 --> 00:10:58,320
don't know how far away they are

324
00:11:02,069 --> 00:10:59,519
if you have something that's just like a

325
00:11:03,990 --> 00:11:02,079
little black speck just in front of you

326
00:11:05,750 --> 00:11:04,000
uh you if you don't know how big that

327
00:11:07,509 --> 00:11:05,760
spec is you don't know if it's actually

328
00:11:09,030 --> 00:11:07,519
in front of you or if it's like several

329
00:11:10,710 --> 00:11:09,040
feet in front of you or perhaps even

330
00:11:12,230 --> 00:11:10,720
miles in front of you especially if you

331
00:11:13,910 --> 00:11:12,240
close one eye you don't have a stereo

332
00:11:15,590 --> 00:11:13,920
vision you use your camera which doesn't

333
00:11:19,350 --> 00:11:15,600
have stereo vision

334
00:11:20,550 --> 00:11:19,360
small or far away is a a major problem

335
00:11:23,110 --> 00:11:20,560
when people are trying to figure out

336
00:11:26,790 --> 00:11:23,120
where things are the military

337
00:11:28,230 --> 00:11:26,800
is not very helpful a missile was

338
00:11:32,069 --> 00:11:28,240
launched over los angeles

339
00:11:34,310 --> 00:11:32,079
and yet they were like i don't know so

340
00:11:35,190 --> 00:11:34,320
the military is is hampered because

341
00:11:36,949 --> 00:11:35,200
everything they

342
00:11:38,870 --> 00:11:36,959
tell the public has to go through

343
00:11:40,470 --> 00:11:38,880
official channels they can't just

344
00:11:41,990 --> 00:11:40,480
like look it up on their servers and say

345
00:11:44,230 --> 00:11:42,000
oh yeah that was uh that was this

346
00:11:45,750 --> 00:11:44,240
all that they have to they have to

347
00:11:47,829 --> 00:11:45,760
declassify everything essentially have

348
00:11:49,670 --> 00:11:47,839
to approve it for public release

349
00:11:50,870 --> 00:11:49,680
so when you ask the military something

350
00:11:52,310 --> 00:11:50,880
you're not going to get an answer

351
00:11:52,790 --> 00:11:52,320
straight away and you may not get an

352
00:11:55,030 --> 00:11:52,800
answer

353
00:11:55,990 --> 00:11:55,040
ever because things may end up being

354
00:11:59,269 --> 00:11:56,000
classified

355
00:12:02,310 --> 00:11:59,279
by default all right

356
00:12:03,750 --> 00:12:02,320
uh case number two the chilean navy ufo

357
00:12:07,110 --> 00:12:03,760
this was an interesting uh

358
00:12:10,310 --> 00:12:07,120
case and uh it's this infrared video

359
00:12:11,910 --> 00:12:10,320
it's infrared and in this in this video

360
00:12:13,670 --> 00:12:11,920
infrared video

361
00:12:15,030 --> 00:12:13,680
black is actually hot so this is kind of

362
00:12:15,750 --> 00:12:15,040
inverted from what you would you would

363
00:12:18,389 --> 00:12:15,760
think of

364
00:12:20,629 --> 00:12:18,399
as being a normal infrared where white

365
00:12:22,230 --> 00:12:20,639
would be hot so the black objects here

366
00:12:25,430 --> 00:12:22,240
are hot so the thing in the middle

367
00:12:28,629 --> 00:12:25,440
of the screen here is actually uh

368
00:12:30,790 --> 00:12:28,639
actually a hot object and it's

369
00:12:32,790 --> 00:12:30,800
uh it's interesting because it leaves

370
00:12:34,629 --> 00:12:32,800
this this trail which is also

371
00:12:36,310 --> 00:12:34,639
appears to be hot so it was very

372
00:12:36,550 --> 00:12:36,320
mysterious as to what this actually was

373
00:12:48,949 --> 00:12:36,560
and

374
00:12:51,030 --> 00:12:48,959
they were very effusive about this they

375
00:12:53,110 --> 00:12:51,040
said this was an exceptional nine-minute

376
00:12:54,470 --> 00:12:53,120
navy video of a ufo displaying highly

377
00:12:56,389 --> 00:12:54,480
unusual behavior

378
00:12:57,670 --> 00:12:56,399
studied by chilean authorities for the

379
00:12:59,430 --> 00:12:57,680
past two years

380
00:13:01,190 --> 00:12:59,440
and like that sinking they studied it

381
00:13:02,870 --> 00:13:01,200
for two years

382
00:13:04,389 --> 00:13:02,880
these were highly trained professionals

383
00:13:05,910 --> 00:13:04,399
with many years experience

384
00:13:07,990 --> 00:13:05,920
and they were absolutely certain that

385
00:13:09,590 --> 00:13:08,000
they could not explain what they saw

386
00:13:11,110 --> 00:13:09,600
this is something we hear a lot as well

387
00:13:13,670 --> 00:13:11,120
highly trained professionals

388
00:13:15,590 --> 00:13:13,680
experts can't explain it and the

389
00:13:18,310 --> 00:13:15,600
official conclusion was that it's a uap

390
00:13:19,990 --> 00:13:18,320
an under an identified aerial phenomena

391
00:13:22,150 --> 00:13:20,000
due to the number of highly researched

392
00:13:25,190 --> 00:13:22,160
reasons that it was unanimously agreed

393
00:13:27,350 --> 00:13:25,200
could not explain it

394
00:13:28,629 --> 00:13:27,360
that's a lot of convolutive uh way of

395
00:13:29,910 --> 00:13:28,639
saying they eliminated

396
00:13:31,670 --> 00:13:29,920
everything that they thought was

397
00:13:35,590 --> 00:13:31,680
possible so it must be the

398
00:13:38,870 --> 00:13:35,600
impossible a alien spaceship

399
00:13:41,189 --> 00:13:38,880
the problem here is that something i

400
00:13:44,870 --> 00:13:41,199
call premature elimination

401
00:13:47,350 --> 00:13:44,880
people like to cross things off a list

402
00:13:48,629 --> 00:13:47,360
so the experts start studying this this

403
00:13:50,629 --> 00:13:48,639
thing and they eliminate

404
00:13:52,230 --> 00:13:50,639
all these things on the list so first of

405
00:13:54,150 --> 00:13:52,240
all they eliminate a plane

406
00:13:55,590 --> 00:13:54,160
uh it couldn't be a plane because it

407
00:13:57,269 --> 00:13:55,600
wouldn't have shown up it would have

408
00:13:58,710 --> 00:13:57,279
shown up on the radar and it didn't

409
00:14:00,550 --> 00:13:58,720
it would have answered the radio and it

410
00:14:02,310 --> 00:14:00,560
didn't answer the radio planes don't

411
00:14:04,470 --> 00:14:02,320
dump hot liquid uh

412
00:14:06,389 --> 00:14:04,480
and contrails if it was a plain contrail

413
00:14:07,350 --> 00:14:06,399
only form above 26 000 feet and they

414
00:14:10,629 --> 00:14:07,360
thought it was around 10

415
00:14:11,110 --> 00:14:10,639
000 feet so not a plate they eliminate a

416
00:14:12,790 --> 00:14:11,120
plane

417
00:14:13,990 --> 00:14:12,800
it's not space junk which seems fairly

418
00:14:15,110 --> 00:14:14,000
obvious you're not going to get things

419
00:14:17,030 --> 00:14:15,120
flying out of space that

420
00:14:18,629 --> 00:14:17,040
would look like that it's not a hoax

421
00:14:19,750 --> 00:14:18,639
they analyzed the video couldn't find

422
00:14:21,509 --> 00:14:19,760
anything wrong with it it's not a

423
00:14:23,590 --> 00:14:21,519
balloon because it was moving

424
00:14:24,550 --> 00:14:23,600
like too fast and balloons don't spew

425
00:14:26,790 --> 00:14:24,560
things out either

426
00:14:28,310 --> 00:14:26,800
wasn't a bird or an insect obviously not

427
00:14:30,629 --> 00:14:28,320
i don't know why they even did that

428
00:14:31,829 --> 00:14:30,639
not a drone and the reason for that was

429
00:14:34,310 --> 00:14:31,839
that it would have been registered and

430
00:14:36,790 --> 00:14:34,320
they would have known where it was

431
00:14:38,150 --> 00:14:36,800
not a parachute or a hang glider uh

432
00:14:40,310 --> 00:14:38,160
because it looks wrong

433
00:14:42,470 --> 00:14:40,320
and so they they eliminated all of these

434
00:14:44,230 --> 00:14:42,480
uh these possibilities and this

435
00:14:46,389 --> 00:14:44,240
is an actual photograph this photograph

436
00:14:48,310 --> 00:14:46,399
here is actually this group of people

437
00:14:48,949 --> 00:14:48,320
this safer scientific and military

438
00:14:50,949 --> 00:14:48,959
committee

439
00:14:52,470 --> 00:14:50,959
a bunch of people from the military and

440
00:14:54,710 --> 00:14:52,480
the scientific community

441
00:14:55,829 --> 00:14:54,720
got together every few weeks to discuss

442
00:14:57,189 --> 00:14:55,839
this for two years

443
00:14:58,470 --> 00:14:57,199
some did a bunch of tests tried to

444
00:14:59,910 --> 00:14:58,480
figure it out they couldn't figure it

445
00:15:02,389 --> 00:14:59,920
out took them two years

446
00:15:04,230 --> 00:15:02,399
so they eventually released the story to

447
00:15:07,430 --> 00:15:04,240
the huffington post

448
00:15:08,790 --> 00:15:07,440
so metabunk my website uh we did an

449
00:15:10,790 --> 00:15:08,800
investigation on

450
00:15:12,470 --> 00:15:10,800
january 5th huffington post released the

451
00:15:15,509 --> 00:15:12,480
video january 6

452
00:15:17,350 --> 00:15:15,519
somebody tweets to me at mcques could be

453
00:15:18,870 --> 00:15:17,360
a plane in his contrail

454
00:15:21,430 --> 00:15:18,880
now i hadn't seen this before so i took

455
00:15:24,150 --> 00:15:21,440
a look at it and uh could he be yes

456
00:15:26,069 --> 00:15:24,160
yes he could and i i recognize this as a

457
00:15:29,430 --> 00:15:26,079
type of contrail called an

458
00:15:31,269 --> 00:15:29,440
aerodynamic contrail which is

459
00:15:32,550 --> 00:15:31,279
a type of contrail that forms at much

460
00:15:33,670 --> 00:15:32,560
lower altitudes

461
00:15:35,590 --> 00:15:33,680
now you might ask you know what's an

462
00:15:37,269 --> 00:15:35,600
area what's aerodynamic about it

463
00:15:38,790 --> 00:15:37,279
there's two types of contrails

464
00:15:41,030 --> 00:15:38,800
aerodynamic contrails and

465
00:15:42,629 --> 00:15:41,040
exhaust contrails exhaust controls are

466
00:15:44,150 --> 00:15:42,639
what you normally see it's the exhaust

467
00:15:46,389 --> 00:15:44,160
coming out of the engine

468
00:15:47,430 --> 00:15:46,399
aerodynamic contrails they form over the

469
00:15:49,509 --> 00:15:47,440
wings

470
00:15:51,110 --> 00:15:49,519
and they actually form in different

471
00:15:53,350 --> 00:15:51,120
atmospheric conditions

472
00:15:55,110 --> 00:15:53,360
and so they they can they can form at a

473
00:15:56,550 --> 00:15:55,120
lower altitude so

474
00:15:58,710 --> 00:15:56,560
that was also something that the experts

475
00:16:01,910 --> 00:15:58,720
were wrong about

476
00:16:04,629 --> 00:16:01,920
so why is it hot they they say uh

477
00:16:05,430 --> 00:16:04,639
how can it be hot contrails are clouds

478
00:16:06,949 --> 00:16:05,440
so

479
00:16:09,110 --> 00:16:06,959
clouds will be cold if they're up in the

480
00:16:09,430 --> 00:16:09,120
sky uh but you know two things about

481
00:16:11,430 --> 00:16:09,440
that

482
00:16:12,949 --> 00:16:11,440
first of all look at the other clouds

483
00:16:15,350 --> 00:16:12,959
the other clouds are also

484
00:16:16,870 --> 00:16:15,360
hot looking they're dark now this one

485
00:16:18,470 --> 00:16:16,880
over here is just as dark as the

486
00:16:20,949 --> 00:16:18,480
contrail

487
00:16:22,150 --> 00:16:20,959
and the reason that they are they are

488
00:16:24,470 --> 00:16:22,160
hot is that the sky

489
00:16:26,790 --> 00:16:24,480
actually shows up as being cold if you

490
00:16:30,069 --> 00:16:26,800
do an experiment where you take a candle

491
00:16:33,030 --> 00:16:30,079
and you take a uh some ice

492
00:16:34,310 --> 00:16:33,040
and you do it against a background like

493
00:16:37,030 --> 00:16:34,320
this you see the candle looks

494
00:16:38,629 --> 00:16:37,040
uh hot and the ice looks cold but you

495
00:16:39,829 --> 00:16:38,639
think you then tilt the camera down so

496
00:16:42,870 --> 00:16:39,839
you're looking up

497
00:16:45,590 --> 00:16:42,880
like this here then both

498
00:16:47,189 --> 00:16:45,600
the candle and the ice look like they're

499
00:16:49,670 --> 00:16:47,199
hotter than the sky

500
00:16:51,110 --> 00:16:49,680
because the the sky is showing up as

501
00:16:52,949 --> 00:16:51,120
off-the-scale cold because it's not

502
00:16:54,790 --> 00:16:52,959
really radiating anything

503
00:16:56,629 --> 00:16:54,800
and the ice itself just shows up as

504
00:16:58,790 --> 00:16:56,639
about eight degrees fahrenheit

505
00:17:01,749 --> 00:16:58,800
so they were wrong about the

506
00:17:04,870 --> 00:17:01,759
impossibility of a control

507
00:17:06,470 --> 00:17:04,880
so what actually was it well

508
00:17:07,909 --> 00:17:06,480
if it was a plane we should be able to

509
00:17:09,750 --> 00:17:07,919
find the plane and we have enough

510
00:17:10,390 --> 00:17:09,760
information on this video that we can

511
00:17:12,710 --> 00:17:10,400
actually

512
00:17:14,789 --> 00:17:12,720
track it down we have the date and the

513
00:17:15,750 --> 00:17:14,799
time and we have the latitude and

514
00:17:17,429 --> 00:17:15,760
longitude

515
00:17:19,510 --> 00:17:17,439
of the helicopter and we know which

516
00:17:22,710 --> 00:17:19,520
direction it's looking in because we can

517
00:17:26,309 --> 00:17:22,720
um we can match the video to to the

518
00:17:29,110 --> 00:17:26,319
uh the background

519
00:17:29,590 --> 00:17:29,120
so we looked in planefinder.net this was

520
00:17:31,669 --> 00:17:29,600
you know

521
00:17:33,830 --> 00:17:31,679
several years ago before flight radio 24

522
00:17:35,990 --> 00:17:33,840
was recording things planefinder.net

523
00:17:37,110 --> 00:17:36,000
and we found there was uh two planes

524
00:17:39,350 --> 00:17:37,120
that kind of fit

525
00:17:41,669 --> 00:17:39,360
fit the bill this one over here iberian

526
00:17:42,789 --> 00:17:41,679
6830 and this one over here uh i can't

527
00:17:44,150 --> 00:17:42,799
remember what it was but

528
00:17:46,630 --> 00:17:44,160
this wasn't the one this was actually

529
00:17:50,070 --> 00:17:46,640
the one here

530
00:17:52,070 --> 00:17:50,080
we took those planes and we

531
00:17:54,150 --> 00:17:52,080
brought them into google earth same as

532
00:17:57,909 --> 00:17:54,160
before

533
00:17:58,870 --> 00:17:57,919
and we plotted the tracks

534
00:18:00,310 --> 00:17:58,880
we moved the camera to where the

535
00:18:02,150 --> 00:18:00,320
helicopter was we overlaid the

536
00:18:04,549 --> 00:18:02,160
helicopter image and we

537
00:18:05,750 --> 00:18:04,559
looked to see where they crossed and

538
00:18:08,390 --> 00:18:05,760
right here

539
00:18:10,950 --> 00:18:08,400
this green one actually was a match so

540
00:18:15,669 --> 00:18:10,960
we tracked down the actual plane

541
00:18:18,630 --> 00:18:15,679
uh we also took it into google earth

542
00:18:20,310 --> 00:18:18,640
and put in a model of a plane in the

543
00:18:22,950 --> 00:18:20,320
right spot

544
00:18:24,230 --> 00:18:22,960
and then moved the camera back to where

545
00:18:28,710 --> 00:18:24,240
the helicopter was and saw what that

546
00:18:30,789 --> 00:18:28,720
would look like

547
00:18:32,070 --> 00:18:30,799
and you can see it's in the right place

548
00:18:33,669 --> 00:18:32,080
but the image

549
00:18:35,510 --> 00:18:33,679
the black image is a lot bigger than the

550
00:18:36,390 --> 00:18:35,520
plane it actually is but so why is that

551
00:18:40,150 --> 00:18:36,400
why is that

552
00:18:43,190 --> 00:18:40,160
so much bigger the reason it's bigger

553
00:18:43,590 --> 00:18:43,200
is something that relates to the uh uh

554
00:18:46,310 --> 00:18:43,600
the

555
00:18:47,190 --> 00:18:46,320
navy videos which i'm coming to soon is

556
00:18:50,150 --> 00:18:47,200
that it's glare

557
00:18:51,750 --> 00:18:50,160
it's infrared glare and glare is

558
00:18:53,990 --> 00:18:51,760
different from lens flare glare

559
00:18:55,669 --> 00:18:54,000
is the stray light around a very bright

560
00:18:56,150 --> 00:18:55,679
light source like i say a flashlight for

561
00:18:57,909 --> 00:18:56,160
example

562
00:18:59,430 --> 00:18:57,919
it's the light around a flashlight it's

563
00:19:02,789 --> 00:18:59,440
not the lens flare which is

564
00:19:04,870 --> 00:19:02,799
something else now uh

565
00:19:05,830 --> 00:19:04,880
infrared glare is essentially the same

566
00:19:08,870 --> 00:19:05,840
as

567
00:19:09,430 --> 00:19:08,880
uh glare around a light it's spill over

568
00:19:11,029 --> 00:19:09,440
light

569
00:19:12,950 --> 00:19:11,039
around an object now it's usually

570
00:19:14,870 --> 00:19:12,960
several orders of magnitude

571
00:19:16,950 --> 00:19:14,880
less bright than the actual light itself

572
00:19:18,710 --> 00:19:16,960
so even though there's the exact same

573
00:19:20,470 --> 00:19:18,720
glare around my finger here

574
00:19:21,990 --> 00:19:20,480
you can't see it because it's so much

575
00:19:23,830 --> 00:19:22,000
dimmer than the actual finger

576
00:19:25,830 --> 00:19:23,840
but with a bright light it's bright

577
00:19:29,029 --> 00:19:25,840
enough that you can actually see it

578
00:19:29,990 --> 00:19:29,039
and uh i did an experiment to

579
00:19:33,669 --> 00:19:30,000
demonstrate this

580
00:19:34,310 --> 00:19:33,679
i put four candles uh the same spacing

581
00:19:36,870 --> 00:19:34,320
as the

582
00:19:38,310 --> 00:19:36,880
engines of the plane and then i took

583
00:19:39,590 --> 00:19:38,320
video of it from far away and you see

584
00:19:41,270 --> 00:19:39,600
from far away

585
00:19:42,950 --> 00:19:41,280
you get this kind of blob shape thing

586
00:19:45,430 --> 00:19:42,960
which is similar to what you saw

587
00:19:47,110 --> 00:19:45,440
but if you start moving closer towards

588
00:19:48,310 --> 00:19:47,120
these four candles they gradually

589
00:19:52,230 --> 00:19:48,320
resolve

590
00:19:53,029 --> 00:19:52,240
into four individual candles so that

591
00:19:55,990 --> 00:19:53,039
shows that

592
00:19:58,470 --> 00:19:56,000
when something is far away uh it

593
00:20:01,029 --> 00:19:58,480
actually looks

594
00:20:02,310 --> 00:20:01,039
much bigger in in the infrared glare so

595
00:20:03,909 --> 00:20:02,320
we've got this big infrared glare

596
00:20:08,789 --> 00:20:03,919
covering the four candles same thing

597
00:20:12,470 --> 00:20:11,270
okay so it was it was a 100 solved it

598
00:20:14,230 --> 00:20:12,480
was just a plane it was leaving a

599
00:20:14,950 --> 00:20:14,240
control so what lessons can we learn

600
00:20:17,590 --> 00:20:14,960
from this

601
00:20:19,110 --> 00:20:17,600
uh experts make mistakes even if you

602
00:20:20,630 --> 00:20:19,120
have lots and lots of experts

603
00:20:22,390 --> 00:20:20,640
military pilots make mistake the

604
00:20:24,390 --> 00:20:22,400
helicopter pilots were the accomplished

605
00:20:26,070 --> 00:20:24,400
military military pilots lauded

606
00:20:27,990 --> 00:20:26,080
lauded by the huffington post

607
00:20:30,230 --> 00:20:28,000
perspective can be confusing again

608
00:20:31,510 --> 00:20:30,240
infrared glare can hide a plane and

609
00:20:32,870 --> 00:20:31,520
that's a very important thing because it

610
00:20:35,590 --> 00:20:32,880
relates to the uh

611
00:20:36,950 --> 00:20:35,600
the the u.s navy videos radio doesn't

612
00:20:38,789 --> 00:20:36,960
help if you're looking in the wrong

613
00:20:41,909 --> 00:20:38,799
direction the wrong location

614
00:20:42,390 --> 00:20:41,919
if it's only uh if you think the object

615
00:20:44,390 --> 00:20:42,400
is

616
00:20:46,070 --> 00:20:44,400
20 miles away but it's actually 60 miles

617
00:20:48,630 --> 00:20:46,080
away then you're not going to find it

618
00:20:50,470 --> 00:20:48,640
and the same thing with the radio uh the

619
00:20:51,669 --> 00:20:50,480
radio if they're on a different

620
00:20:53,669 --> 00:20:51,679
area they're going to have a different

621
00:20:56,950 --> 00:20:53,679
radio frequency and so hailing them on

622
00:20:58,710 --> 00:20:56,960
my common frequency isn't going to work

623
00:21:01,029 --> 00:20:58,720
being wrong for years does not make you

624
00:21:03,270 --> 00:21:01,039
right they spent two years on this they

625
00:21:03,590 --> 00:21:03,280
got it wrong and they released it and it

626
00:21:05,750 --> 00:21:03,600
was

627
00:21:07,590 --> 00:21:05,760
disproven straight away which brings to

628
00:21:08,789 --> 00:21:07,600
the last point which is uh ask the

629
00:21:11,590 --> 00:21:08,799
internet

630
00:21:12,630 --> 00:21:11,600
uh you shouldn't have just this room of

631
00:21:14,710 --> 00:21:12,640
experts

632
00:21:16,149 --> 00:21:14,720
there's a huge array of talent out there

633
00:21:16,710 --> 00:21:16,159
lots of people are interested in this

634
00:21:19,430 --> 00:21:16,720
stuff

635
00:21:20,630 --> 00:21:19,440
and if this video had been released two

636
00:21:23,029 --> 00:21:20,640
years earlier

637
00:21:24,950 --> 00:21:23,039
than it was it would have been solved

638
00:21:25,510 --> 00:21:24,960
two years earlier than it actually was

639
00:21:27,510 --> 00:21:25,520
solved

640
00:21:29,270 --> 00:21:27,520
instead they spent two years all these

641
00:21:30,950 --> 00:21:29,280
guys wasting their time

642
00:21:33,190 --> 00:21:30,960
and then they released it when it was

643
00:21:35,669 --> 00:21:33,200
solved in a week

644
00:21:36,310 --> 00:21:35,679
okay let's get to the us navy videos

645
00:21:38,310 --> 00:21:36,320
fleur one

646
00:21:39,590 --> 00:21:38,320
gimbal and go fast gonna start with

647
00:21:42,549 --> 00:21:39,600
flair one

648
00:21:45,190 --> 00:21:42,559
floor one was filmed in 2004. important

649
00:21:48,149 --> 00:21:45,200
thing to note nobody saw it by eye

650
00:21:48,630 --> 00:21:48,159
uh it shows a infrared glare on the

651
00:21:50,710 --> 00:21:48,640
camera

652
00:21:53,190 --> 00:21:50,720
and then an indistinct blob and it kind

653
00:21:54,390 --> 00:21:53,200
of changes camera or loss and then

654
00:21:56,310 --> 00:21:54,400
it looks like it's making some sudden

655
00:21:57,590 --> 00:21:56,320
moves and these sort of moves generally

656
00:21:59,669 --> 00:21:57,600
coincide with camera

657
00:22:02,070 --> 00:21:59,679
changes so the question is is the object

658
00:22:03,830 --> 00:22:02,080
moving or is the camera moving

659
00:22:05,110 --> 00:22:03,840
and people who think the object is

660
00:22:07,110 --> 00:22:05,120
moving claim that it's moving with

661
00:22:08,710 --> 00:22:07,120
incredible g-forces incredibly high

662
00:22:10,950 --> 00:22:08,720
acceleration rates

663
00:22:12,470 --> 00:22:10,960
which it would actually be if these were

664
00:22:14,470 --> 00:22:12,480
actual real movements i think it comes

665
00:22:16,390 --> 00:22:14,480
out as something like 70 g's

666
00:22:17,590 --> 00:22:16,400
which is way way in advance of any

667
00:22:20,310 --> 00:22:17,600
aircraft that we have

668
00:22:21,830 --> 00:22:20,320
currently they top out around like 10

669
00:22:25,350 --> 00:22:21,840
tops i think

670
00:22:32,390 --> 00:22:30,549
flow one is it small or far away um

671
00:22:34,630 --> 00:22:32,400
this is you know the big question with

672
00:22:36,789 --> 00:22:34,640
ufos is it a small object that is close

673
00:22:37,669 --> 00:22:36,799
to the camera or it is a larger object

674
00:22:39,510 --> 00:22:37,679
that is

675
00:22:40,789 --> 00:22:39,520
uh far away we can actually do some math

676
00:22:44,070 --> 00:22:40,799
here

677
00:22:46,230 --> 00:22:44,080
we can see that it if we

678
00:22:48,149 --> 00:22:46,240
chop out the image itself it takes 14 of

679
00:22:51,110 --> 00:22:48,159
its own sizes to cross over the field of

680
00:22:53,390 --> 00:22:51,120
view we know the field of view is 0.35

681
00:22:55,430 --> 00:22:53,400
degrees we can divide that by 14 to get

682
00:22:57,669 --> 00:22:55,440
0.025 degrees

683
00:22:59,909 --> 00:22:57,679
we can then do a little bit more math to

684
00:23:03,590 --> 00:22:59,919
figure out what's actually going on here

685
00:23:06,549 --> 00:23:03,600
the size of something in an image

686
00:23:07,990 --> 00:23:06,559
which i know from my 3d 3d programming

687
00:23:10,630 --> 00:23:08,000
is the distance multiplied

688
00:23:12,230 --> 00:23:10,640
by the tangent of the angle it's

689
00:23:13,909 --> 00:23:12,240
actually two times uh the tangent of

690
00:23:16,070 --> 00:23:13,919
half the angle but for our purpose is

691
00:23:19,190 --> 00:23:16,080
this works exactly the same

692
00:23:20,710 --> 00:23:19,200
two times the tangent of 0.25 or

693
00:23:23,430 --> 00:23:20,720
uh just the distance times angle in

694
00:23:25,750 --> 00:23:23,440
radians if you want to get technical

695
00:23:27,430 --> 00:23:25,760
for small angles so the size in feet is

696
00:23:28,070 --> 00:23:27,440
the distance in miles times the number

697
00:23:30,789 --> 00:23:28,080
of feet

698
00:23:32,310 --> 00:23:30,799
in a mile sorry to use feet for the

699
00:23:35,350 --> 00:23:32,320
canadian audience here but

700
00:23:37,510 --> 00:23:35,360
uh i'm in america multiplied by the

701
00:23:39,669 --> 00:23:37,520
tangent of 0.25

702
00:23:41,110 --> 00:23:39,679
so that gives a nice round estimate of

703
00:23:42,789 --> 00:23:41,120
the size in feet of the object

704
00:23:44,789 --> 00:23:42,799
is just simply the distance in miles

705
00:23:46,149 --> 00:23:44,799
multiplied by 2.3

706
00:23:48,310 --> 00:23:46,159
which is nice and straightforward

707
00:23:50,710 --> 00:23:48,320
because we can use that to get some very

708
00:23:53,029 --> 00:23:50,720
rough estimates if it was a mile away

709
00:23:53,990 --> 00:23:53,039
then this object would only be 2.3 feet

710
00:23:55,990 --> 00:23:54,000
in um

711
00:23:57,510 --> 00:23:56,000
in width if it was 10 miles away

712
00:23:57,990 --> 00:23:57,520
obviously it would be 10 times that 23

713
00:24:01,269 --> 00:23:58,000
feet

714
00:24:02,230 --> 00:24:01,279
getting into the range of actual

715
00:24:04,230 --> 00:24:02,240
aircraft that

716
00:24:06,950 --> 00:24:04,240
could be could be the size of a fighter

717
00:24:08,789 --> 00:24:06,960
jet so one possibility is that this is a

718
00:24:11,430 --> 00:24:08,799
out-of-focus fighter jet that

719
00:24:13,510 --> 00:24:11,440
is 20 miles away it's quite a long way

720
00:24:15,029 --> 00:24:13,520
to see something 20 miles

721
00:24:17,990 --> 00:24:15,039
or it could be something like a boeing

722
00:24:19,590 --> 00:24:18,000
737 that is 50 miles away

723
00:24:23,590 --> 00:24:19,600
uh that's another possibility we don't

724
00:24:28,630 --> 00:24:27,029
as well as being small or far away we uh

725
00:24:30,870 --> 00:24:28,640
is it small and low or is it big and

726
00:24:31,830 --> 00:24:30,880
high we've got another number here which

727
00:24:34,549 --> 00:24:31,840
is this

728
00:24:35,750 --> 00:24:34,559
five degrees here which is the angle

729
00:24:38,950 --> 00:24:35,760
that the camera is looking

730
00:24:40,470 --> 00:24:38,960
up at and uh if we're looking up into

731
00:24:41,909 --> 00:24:40,480
the sky there's only so high our plane

732
00:24:43,430 --> 00:24:41,919
could be a plane is not going to be at a

733
00:24:45,110 --> 00:24:43,440
hundred thousand feet so it kind of

734
00:24:46,789 --> 00:24:45,120
gives us some more limits as to what we

735
00:24:49,110 --> 00:24:46,799
can actually calculate

736
00:24:50,630 --> 00:24:49,120
if uh we know the camera's at twenty

737
00:24:51,350 --> 00:24:50,640
thousand feet we have that number down

738
00:24:52,630 --> 00:24:51,360
here

739
00:24:54,710 --> 00:24:52,640
and we know we're looking at five

740
00:24:55,990 --> 00:24:54,720
degrees so the object is above the

741
00:24:58,950 --> 00:24:56,000
twenty thousand feet by

742
00:25:01,669 --> 00:24:58,960
some mass again distance in miles times

743
00:25:03,750 --> 00:25:01,679
5280 times sine of five degrees

744
00:25:05,669 --> 00:25:03,760
or 20 000 plus the difference in miles

745
00:25:08,549 --> 00:25:05,679
size 460.

746
00:25:10,390 --> 00:25:08,559
nice round uh estimate so again we can

747
00:25:12,070 --> 00:25:10,400
figure out the various uh things that it

748
00:25:13,750 --> 00:25:12,080
could be so

749
00:25:15,350 --> 00:25:13,760
quite all quite reasonable numbers less

750
00:25:17,430 --> 00:25:15,360
than 40 000 feet which is like the

751
00:25:19,430 --> 00:25:17,440
service ceiling for uh some aircraft but

752
00:25:21,990 --> 00:25:19,440
some aircraft can go higher

753
00:25:23,669 --> 00:25:22,000
so could it be a mid-sized jet like this

754
00:25:26,789 --> 00:25:23,679
one for example a 737

755
00:25:29,430 --> 00:25:26,799
that's uh 40 to 50 miles away

756
00:25:30,870 --> 00:25:29,440
well it's black in the video in the in

757
00:25:33,510 --> 00:25:30,880
the visible light mode

758
00:25:35,830 --> 00:25:33,520
and uh it's it's very blurry and out of

759
00:25:37,430 --> 00:25:35,840
focus and it's very low resolution

760
00:25:38,950 --> 00:25:37,440
and it's got a lot of noise in the video

761
00:25:40,310 --> 00:25:38,960
a lot of perspective compression

762
00:25:43,750 --> 00:25:40,320
artifacts

763
00:25:46,149 --> 00:25:43,760
uh and it's at a funny angle so perhaps

764
00:25:47,190 --> 00:25:46,159
yeah if it's at this angle perhaps it

765
00:25:49,110 --> 00:25:47,200
could actually be

766
00:25:50,630 --> 00:25:49,120
a plane look kind of similar and when it

767
00:25:51,430 --> 00:25:50,640
rotates a bit yeah it's just a plane a

768
00:25:52,789 --> 00:25:51,440
different shape

769
00:25:54,310 --> 00:25:52,799
this plane is actually facing the wrong

770
00:25:55,669 --> 00:25:54,320
way for the motion of travel but it's

771
00:25:57,430 --> 00:25:55,679
the same basic idea

772
00:25:59,110 --> 00:25:57,440
you just take something like a plane and

773
00:26:00,710 --> 00:25:59,120
you blur it enough and it's uh

774
00:26:03,830 --> 00:26:00,720
it will look like this it could actually

775
00:26:07,750 --> 00:26:05,750
so uh the big question about this one is

776
00:26:08,549 --> 00:26:07,760
if it's a jet why does it accelerate so

777
00:26:11,110 --> 00:26:08,559
fast

778
00:26:12,070 --> 00:26:11,120
it actually leaves leaves the frame and

779
00:26:13,750 --> 00:26:12,080
you can see it here i've kind of

780
00:26:16,470 --> 00:26:13,760
corrected for the uh

781
00:26:17,350 --> 00:26:16,480
the zoom change in the middle here uh it

782
00:26:19,669 --> 00:26:17,360
leaves the frame

783
00:26:22,070 --> 00:26:19,679
in three quarters of a second three

784
00:26:24,149 --> 00:26:22,080
quarters of a second which means

785
00:26:25,110 --> 00:26:24,159
as we know the width of the frame in

786
00:26:28,630 --> 00:26:25,120
degrees

787
00:26:31,190 --> 00:26:28,640
it's going at 4.3 seconds per degree

788
00:26:32,789 --> 00:26:31,200
which coincidentally is exactly the same

789
00:26:35,830 --> 00:26:32,799
rate that the camera was panning

790
00:26:37,190 --> 00:26:35,840
to the left now we know the camera is

791
00:26:37,590 --> 00:26:37,200
panning to the left because this number

792
00:26:41,110 --> 00:26:37,600
here

793
00:26:44,390 --> 00:26:41,120
a little hard to read moves from

794
00:26:47,430 --> 00:26:44,400
one degree left 44 seconds

795
00:26:50,390 --> 00:26:47,440
to 8 degrees left at

796
00:26:51,430 --> 00:26:50,400
1 minute 12 seconds so it's moved 70

797
00:26:53,830 --> 00:26:51,440
degrees

798
00:26:55,110 --> 00:26:53,840
smoothly panning from left to right from

799
00:26:57,750 --> 00:26:55,120
right to left

800
00:26:59,750 --> 00:26:57,760
uh in about 30 seconds which is about

801
00:27:02,230 --> 00:26:59,760
4.2 seconds per degree

802
00:27:04,070 --> 00:27:02,240
and that was coincidentally the exact

803
00:27:06,549 --> 00:27:04,080
rate that we calculated

804
00:27:08,710 --> 00:27:06,559
the objects leaving the screen

805
00:27:11,430 --> 00:27:08,720
coincidence i think not

806
00:27:12,470 --> 00:27:11,440
uh what do i think happened at the end

807
00:27:14,149 --> 00:27:12,480
of this video

808
00:27:16,390 --> 00:27:14,159
i think that the camera was following a

809
00:27:17,909 --> 00:27:16,400
plane probably about 40 miles away it's

810
00:27:19,510 --> 00:27:17,919
in level flight it's not doing anything

811
00:27:22,070 --> 00:27:19,520
special

812
00:27:23,909 --> 00:27:22,080
the camera is slowly panning to the left

813
00:27:25,269 --> 00:27:23,919
because it wants to follow the plane the

814
00:27:26,950 --> 00:27:25,279
plane is just kind of moving off

815
00:27:29,830 --> 00:27:26,960
in that general direction it's moving

816
00:27:31,350 --> 00:27:29,840
very slowly not nothing special

817
00:27:33,510 --> 00:27:31,360
but then there's all these rapid camera

818
00:27:34,870 --> 00:27:33,520
changes the the camera flips between

819
00:27:36,230 --> 00:27:34,880
different modes it flips between

820
00:27:38,149 --> 00:27:36,240
different magnifications and at some

821
00:27:39,990 --> 00:27:38,159
point it actually loses lock

822
00:27:42,310 --> 00:27:40,000
on the object and it does this a couple

823
00:27:44,070 --> 00:27:42,320
of times uh through the video it loses

824
00:27:46,549 --> 00:27:44,080
lock there you can see these bars

825
00:27:48,789 --> 00:27:46,559
widen and then it regains the lock on

826
00:27:49,590 --> 00:27:48,799
the on the object and carries on but the

827
00:27:51,350 --> 00:27:49,600
last time it

828
00:27:53,269 --> 00:27:51,360
doesn't manage it couldn't quite manage

829
00:27:55,590 --> 00:27:53,279
with all these rapid camera changes

830
00:27:56,470 --> 00:27:55,600
and so it stops tracking and the object

831
00:27:58,549 --> 00:27:56,480
just

832
00:27:59,909 --> 00:27:58,559
goes off to the side of the screen and

833
00:28:01,590 --> 00:27:59,919
that's all that happened it doesn't seem

834
00:28:04,389 --> 00:28:01,600
like it's really

835
00:28:04,870 --> 00:28:04,399
that complicated and yet i have to fight

836
00:28:06,389 --> 00:28:04,880
to

837
00:28:09,029 --> 00:28:06,399
get this explanation across because

838
00:28:11,029 --> 00:28:09,039
people prefer the other explanation

839
00:28:14,310 --> 00:28:11,039
the plane i think is just in level

840
00:28:16,710 --> 00:28:14,320
flight not changing its velocity

841
00:28:18,230 --> 00:28:16,720
and it's not amazing all right moving

842
00:28:20,389 --> 00:28:18,240
quickly on to

843
00:28:21,430 --> 00:28:20,399
go fast we will go fast to the go fast

844
00:28:27,029 --> 00:28:21,440
video

845
00:28:33,269 --> 00:28:27,039
was filmed

846
00:28:34,870 --> 00:28:33,279
in 2014. it looks like it's going very

847
00:28:35,669 --> 00:28:34,880
fast it looks like it's low close to the

848
00:28:37,269 --> 00:28:35,679
water

849
00:28:38,470 --> 00:28:37,279
and it's been described as you know

850
00:28:39,590 --> 00:28:38,480
traveling at two-thirds the speed of

851
00:28:41,990 --> 00:28:39,600
sound hauling ass

852
00:28:43,430 --> 00:28:42,000
is it no yeah we can actually use some

853
00:28:44,710 --> 00:28:43,440
of the information on the screen to

854
00:28:46,870 --> 00:28:44,720
figure this out

855
00:28:48,630 --> 00:28:46,880
we know the altitude we know the speed

856
00:28:51,669 --> 00:28:48,640
of the jet

857
00:28:52,549 --> 00:28:51,679
uh we also dealt with 25 000 feet above

858
00:28:55,269 --> 00:28:52,559
the water

859
00:28:55,750 --> 00:28:55,279
we know we're looking down negative

860
00:28:57,750 --> 00:28:55,760
angle

861
00:28:59,909 --> 00:28:57,760
26 degrees and we know that he actually

862
00:29:01,029 --> 00:28:59,919
gets a radar lock on the object it's 4.4

863
00:29:02,950 --> 00:29:01,039
miles away

864
00:29:04,389 --> 00:29:02,960
we can do some very very simple uh

865
00:29:05,990 --> 00:29:04,399
trigonometry with us

866
00:29:07,510 --> 00:29:06,000
uh to figure out how much the plane is

867
00:29:09,430 --> 00:29:07,520
below uh how much the

868
00:29:10,630 --> 00:29:09,440
how much how much below the plane is

869
00:29:13,830 --> 00:29:10,640
this object how much

870
00:29:14,630 --> 00:29:13,840
down looking down 26 degrees 4.4 miles

871
00:29:17,269 --> 00:29:14,640
away

872
00:29:17,909 --> 00:29:17,279
that's the hypotenuse of the triangle so

873
00:29:19,909 --> 00:29:17,919
we use

874
00:29:21,029 --> 00:29:19,919
uh we just work out what the opposite

875
00:29:24,789 --> 00:29:21,039
side of the it

876
00:29:27,590 --> 00:29:24,799
is which is uh 4.4 times the sine of 26

877
00:29:30,389 --> 00:29:27,600
or 1.92 nautical miles down

878
00:29:32,950 --> 00:29:30,399
about 12 000 feet and which means the

879
00:29:35,750 --> 00:29:32,960
object is at 13 000 feet

880
00:29:37,669 --> 00:29:35,760
which means it's halfway to the ocean

881
00:29:39,430 --> 00:29:37,679
and not very high at all so they were

882
00:29:41,990 --> 00:29:39,440
wrong about that

883
00:29:43,590 --> 00:29:42,000
also if we know all these angles we can

884
00:29:45,510 --> 00:29:43,600
actually figure out that it's

885
00:29:47,110 --> 00:29:45,520
how fast it's going because we know the

886
00:29:48,870 --> 00:29:47,120
angle to the left that it is at the

887
00:29:50,549 --> 00:29:48,880
start the angle it is to the left at the

888
00:29:52,630 --> 00:29:50,559
end we know the jets banking a bit so it

889
00:29:54,070 --> 00:29:52,640
follows this curved path

890
00:29:55,669 --> 00:29:54,080
and we know the range at the start and

891
00:29:57,190 --> 00:29:55,679
we know the range at the end so we can

892
00:29:58,789 --> 00:29:57,200
figure out where the object is

893
00:30:00,789 --> 00:29:58,799
at the start and where the object is at

894
00:30:01,750 --> 00:30:00,799
the end turns out the jet moves this

895
00:30:05,669 --> 00:30:01,760
much

896
00:30:07,350 --> 00:30:05,679
object really isn't moving very fast at

897
00:30:10,070 --> 00:30:07,360
all in fact it's moving around

898
00:30:11,350 --> 00:30:10,080
under under 40 knots which is about wind

899
00:30:12,789 --> 00:30:11,360
speed

900
00:30:14,389 --> 00:30:12,799
we know it's not even very big we can

901
00:30:15,750 --> 00:30:14,399
figure out how big it is it's around six

902
00:30:17,750 --> 00:30:15,760
feet

903
00:30:20,070 --> 00:30:17,760
so what type of flying objects uh moves

904
00:30:22,230 --> 00:30:20,080
around wind speed is a few feet wide

905
00:30:24,389 --> 00:30:22,240
is roughly spherical looks like a dot

906
00:30:28,549 --> 00:30:24,399
has no heat source it just was white

907
00:30:31,590 --> 00:30:28,559
uh in in black hot uh shows up on radar

908
00:30:32,389 --> 00:30:31,600
and what could that be it is in fact a

909
00:30:34,149 --> 00:30:32,399
weather balloon

910
00:30:35,750 --> 00:30:34,159
most simplest explanation is this is

911
00:30:38,389 --> 00:30:35,760
just a weather balloon drifting in the

912
00:30:41,430 --> 00:30:38,399
wind with a radar reflector

913
00:30:45,190 --> 00:30:41,440
on the balloon and uh that

914
00:30:47,830 --> 00:30:45,200
i think is probably all there was to it

915
00:30:49,190 --> 00:30:47,840
uh the uh the extra thing that you need

916
00:30:49,990 --> 00:30:49,200
as well as it being a weather weather

917
00:30:51,669 --> 00:30:50,000
balloon is

918
00:30:52,950 --> 00:30:51,679
to realize that what you're seeing isn't

919
00:30:54,630 --> 00:30:52,960
the motion of the balloon it's the

920
00:30:57,029 --> 00:30:54,640
motion of the parallax

921
00:30:58,789 --> 00:30:57,039
it's a balloon similar type of thing the

922
00:31:00,470 --> 00:30:58,799
balloon isn't really moving it's just

923
00:31:01,830 --> 00:31:00,480
it's just floating in the air but it's

924
00:31:03,830 --> 00:31:01,840
being filled from a helicopter which is

925
00:31:05,350 --> 00:31:03,840
moving very fast past the balloon and

926
00:31:06,710 --> 00:31:05,360
the camera is tracking

927
00:31:08,789 --> 00:31:06,720
this balloon so it gives you this

928
00:31:11,350 --> 00:31:08,799
illusion that this object

929
00:31:12,389 --> 00:31:11,360
is moving very very fast when it really

930
00:31:13,990 --> 00:31:12,399
isn't

931
00:31:15,909 --> 00:31:14,000
so i think that's all we're seeing with

932
00:31:19,110 --> 00:31:15,919
the go fast

933
00:31:19,830 --> 00:31:19,120
video not not low and fast it is high

934
00:31:23,509 --> 00:31:19,840
and slow

935
00:31:25,350 --> 00:31:23,519
probably a blue okay last video is the

936
00:31:29,830 --> 00:31:25,360
gimbal video

937
00:31:32,710 --> 00:31:29,840
day as the go fast video

938
00:31:33,990 --> 00:31:32,720
back in 2015 and it shows a weird source

939
00:31:36,389 --> 00:31:34,000
of shape

940
00:31:37,509 --> 00:31:36,399
and it looks like it's flying rapidly

941
00:31:39,590 --> 00:31:37,519
over the clouds

942
00:31:40,789 --> 00:31:39,600
at some point it slows down it rotates

943
00:31:43,029 --> 00:31:40,799
on its ends and

944
00:31:44,470 --> 00:31:43,039
it stops and this is by far the most

945
00:31:47,590 --> 00:31:44,480
challenging video to explain

946
00:31:49,509 --> 00:31:47,600
so i shall try and get it in the next 10

947
00:31:51,909 --> 00:31:49,519
minutes

948
00:31:53,750 --> 00:31:51,919
uh is it just a glare this was my

949
00:31:54,950 --> 00:31:53,760
initial idea that i thought it was just

950
00:31:57,669 --> 00:31:54,960
a glare someone

951
00:31:58,470 --> 00:31:57,679
showed me the video and i think the same

952
00:32:00,630 --> 00:31:58,480
day

953
00:32:02,470 --> 00:32:00,640
i i suggested it might actually be a

954
00:32:03,509 --> 00:32:02,480
glare it might actually be in red glare

955
00:32:05,029 --> 00:32:03,519
and of course you know the reason was

956
00:32:05,269 --> 00:32:05,039
i've seen this type of thing before in

957
00:32:14,230 --> 00:32:05,279
the

958
00:32:17,509 --> 00:32:14,240
um so yeah yeah it could be a glare

959
00:32:19,590 --> 00:32:17,519
but it's complicated if it's a glare

960
00:32:20,870 --> 00:32:19,600
like why is it shaped like that uh why

961
00:32:22,549 --> 00:32:20,880
can't you see the plane well we can't

962
00:32:23,590 --> 00:32:22,559
know that it's hidden behind a large

963
00:32:25,350 --> 00:32:23,600
color

964
00:32:26,630 --> 00:32:25,360
why does it rotate what's going on here

965
00:32:28,710 --> 00:32:26,640
why is it rotating

966
00:32:30,230 --> 00:32:28,720
and why does it slow down and stop and

967
00:32:32,149 --> 00:32:30,240
at this point when it rotates

968
00:32:33,269 --> 00:32:32,159
it was flying fast over the clouds but

969
00:32:35,590 --> 00:32:33,279
now it's it's

970
00:32:37,990 --> 00:32:35,600
uh it's slowed down and stopped and why

971
00:32:40,230 --> 00:32:38,000
through a cold aura around it here

972
00:32:42,230 --> 00:32:40,240
it's hot it's black hot but around it is

973
00:32:43,669 --> 00:32:42,240
white it's kind of weird

974
00:32:45,110 --> 00:32:43,679
and yeah are we just doing mental

975
00:32:45,590 --> 00:32:45,120
gymnastics here this is something

976
00:32:48,389 --> 00:32:45,600
actually

977
00:32:49,990 --> 00:32:48,399
joe rogan accused me of he said i'm just

978
00:32:51,750 --> 00:32:50,000
doing mental gymnastics

979
00:32:53,669 --> 00:32:51,760
trying to explain these videos and it's

980
00:32:55,830 --> 00:32:53,679
much simpler if we just go with the

981
00:32:57,590 --> 00:32:55,840
its anti-gravity explanation because

982
00:32:59,750 --> 00:32:57,600
that just explains everything

983
00:33:00,950 --> 00:32:59,760
anti-gravity also makes the air cold

984
00:33:02,789 --> 00:33:00,960
apparently

985
00:33:04,630 --> 00:33:02,799
all right let's do that cold thing first

986
00:33:07,110 --> 00:33:04,640
cold aura infrared

987
00:33:09,110 --> 00:33:07,120
uh it's inverted so that black is hot

988
00:33:10,950 --> 00:33:09,120
and that means white is cold is this a

989
00:33:11,830 --> 00:33:10,960
pocket of cold air defying all known

990
00:33:14,870 --> 00:33:11,840
physics

991
00:33:16,789 --> 00:33:14,880
nope it is just in fact um

992
00:33:18,950 --> 00:33:16,799
something you see in infrared videos

993
00:33:19,909 --> 00:33:18,960
here's a hot jet engine here's white

994
00:33:21,269 --> 00:33:19,919
around it

995
00:33:23,269 --> 00:33:21,279
just something that shows up in infrared

996
00:33:26,710 --> 00:33:23,279
videos it's called an unsharp mask

997
00:33:29,590 --> 00:33:26,720
they use it to increase contrast

998
00:33:30,389 --> 00:33:29,600
uh why does it slow down and stop and

999
00:33:32,149 --> 00:33:30,399
stop well

1000
00:33:34,230 --> 00:33:32,159
the reason it's doing that i think again

1001
00:33:35,110 --> 00:33:34,240
is parallax you know we saw the parallax

1002
00:33:37,750 --> 00:33:35,120
with the balloon

1003
00:33:39,029 --> 00:33:37,760
and here the the jet starts out flying

1004
00:33:40,630 --> 00:33:39,039
kind of at an angle

1005
00:33:42,070 --> 00:33:40,640
to the object so he's kind of flying

1006
00:33:44,789 --> 00:33:42,080
with the object off to one side

1007
00:33:45,750 --> 00:33:44,799
it turns around and eventually ends up

1008
00:33:47,509 --> 00:33:45,760
facing it

1009
00:33:48,789 --> 00:33:47,519
so we can kind of simulate that here and

1010
00:33:49,430 --> 00:33:48,799
i've done that with the jet starting

1011
00:33:52,470 --> 00:33:49,440
down here

1012
00:33:54,549 --> 00:33:52,480
it flies up and around and eventually

1013
00:33:57,430 --> 00:33:54,559
it's facing towards the object which is

1014
00:33:59,029 --> 00:33:57,440
over here and the clouds over here move

1015
00:33:59,830 --> 00:33:59,039
as you would expect to start out moving

1016
00:34:02,710 --> 00:33:59,840
fast

1017
00:34:03,269 --> 00:34:02,720
time longer than you would think i would

1018
00:34:05,190 --> 00:34:03,279
i would

1019
00:34:06,710 --> 00:34:05,200
say which way it's confusing then it

1020
00:34:09,270 --> 00:34:06,720
slows down very rapidly

1021
00:34:11,030 --> 00:34:09,280
at the end and that explains why it's

1022
00:34:12,069 --> 00:34:11,040
why it slows down and stop just parallax

1023
00:34:17,430 --> 00:34:12,079
nothing particularly

1024
00:34:21,270 --> 00:34:20,550
why is the glare shaped the way the

1025
00:34:24,550 --> 00:34:21,280
glare is

1026
00:34:26,230 --> 00:34:24,560
um it's diffraction and focus uh the

1027
00:34:28,389 --> 00:34:26,240
shape of a glare is kind of defined

1028
00:34:29,270 --> 00:34:28,399
by how much the light spills around the

1029
00:34:31,270 --> 00:34:29,280
object

1030
00:34:33,270 --> 00:34:31,280
and if you a bit out of focus it will

1031
00:34:34,710 --> 00:34:33,280
spill more in in more directions just

1032
00:34:37,190 --> 00:34:34,720
from the lack of focus

1033
00:34:37,909 --> 00:34:37,200
but it also spills due to diffraction

1034
00:34:40,470 --> 00:34:37,919
effects

1035
00:34:41,669 --> 00:34:40,480
and this is why in in astronomy you see

1036
00:34:44,310 --> 00:34:41,679
these spikes

1037
00:34:46,069 --> 00:34:44,320
on uh on on starts the crash diffraction

1038
00:34:46,710 --> 00:34:46,079
effects from the cross that's in front

1039
00:34:50,310 --> 00:34:46,720
of the

1040
00:34:52,550 --> 00:34:50,320
reflectors

1041
00:34:55,030 --> 00:34:52,560
in the telescope uh so these diffraction

1042
00:34:57,109 --> 00:34:55,040
effects are quite a big thing so

1043
00:34:58,390 --> 00:34:57,119
i made this little video with this this

1044
00:35:00,390 --> 00:34:58,400
plane with

1045
00:35:01,829 --> 00:35:00,400
two jet engines attached to it which are

1046
00:35:03,270 --> 00:35:01,839
actually flashlights but they give the

1047
00:35:04,150 --> 00:35:03,280
same effect in that you only see the

1048
00:35:07,510 --> 00:35:04,160
glare when

1049
00:35:10,550 --> 00:35:07,520
the jet engines are facing towards you

1050
00:35:11,990 --> 00:35:10,560
and let me just start that so if i move

1051
00:35:13,910 --> 00:35:12,000
the camera back you'll see that a big

1052
00:35:14,630 --> 00:35:13,920
layer appears a big spiky glare in this

1053
00:35:16,310 --> 00:35:14,640
camera

1054
00:35:17,750 --> 00:35:16,320
it's kind of source of shapes i guess

1055
00:35:19,510 --> 00:35:17,760
but if i use this this camera

1056
00:35:21,910 --> 00:35:19,520
it gives a more sausage shaped glass

1057
00:35:24,069 --> 00:35:21,920
with a with these spikes on it

1058
00:35:26,069 --> 00:35:24,079
and you see when i rotate the camera the

1059
00:35:28,470 --> 00:35:26,079
background doesn't rotate in this image

1060
00:35:29,990 --> 00:35:28,480
but the glare does rotate so if the

1061
00:35:33,589 --> 00:35:30,000
camera was rotating it would

1062
00:35:36,710 --> 00:35:33,599
make make the glare rotate um

1063
00:35:39,349 --> 00:35:36,720
and the diffraction thing if you touch

1064
00:35:40,069 --> 00:35:39,359
your camera with your finger and smear

1065
00:35:42,630 --> 00:35:40,079
it a little bit

1066
00:35:44,390 --> 00:35:42,640
it changes the shape of the glare and

1067
00:35:46,550 --> 00:35:44,400
what i've been told was that

1068
00:35:48,470 --> 00:35:46,560
these glares appear in these targeting

1069
00:35:50,710 --> 00:35:48,480
pods when people clean

1070
00:35:52,550 --> 00:35:50,720
the front window of the targeting plot

1071
00:35:53,990 --> 00:35:52,560
pod and you see here i'm rotating the

1072
00:35:59,030 --> 00:35:54,000
camera the glare's rotating but the

1073
00:36:01,270 --> 00:35:59,040
background is not rotating

1074
00:36:02,950 --> 00:36:01,280
uh but you know is the camera rotating

1075
00:36:04,630 --> 00:36:02,960
uh i think yes it is and we can tell

1076
00:36:07,270 --> 00:36:04,640
it's rotating because

1077
00:36:08,870 --> 00:36:07,280
uh we see these bands in the sky which

1078
00:36:10,790 --> 00:36:08,880
look like they're rotating

1079
00:36:12,069 --> 00:36:10,800
and uh this is something yeah i

1080
00:36:13,510 --> 00:36:12,079
encourage you to look at this yourself

1081
00:36:15,030 --> 00:36:13,520
and you probably can't see it in this

1082
00:36:16,790 --> 00:36:15,040
maybe in the smaller one but you can

1083
00:36:18,230 --> 00:36:16,800
actually see the entire sky rotating

1084
00:36:19,670 --> 00:36:18,240
which would only happen

1085
00:36:22,069 --> 00:36:19,680
independently of the horizon if the

1086
00:36:23,349 --> 00:36:22,079
camera was rotating why is it rotating

1087
00:36:24,550 --> 00:36:23,359
it's kind of complicated don't really

1088
00:36:26,230 --> 00:36:24,560
have time to get into it

1089
00:36:27,910 --> 00:36:26,240
the fine tracking of the image is done

1090
00:36:29,510 --> 00:36:27,920
with mirrors there's a

1091
00:36:31,349 --> 00:36:29,520
course tracking done with exterior

1092
00:36:32,470 --> 00:36:31,359
gimbals the two big gimbals you see on

1093
00:36:34,470 --> 00:36:32,480
the outside

1094
00:36:35,829 --> 00:36:34,480
two axis gimbals can't traverse zero

1095
00:36:38,950 --> 00:36:35,839
degrees when looking around

1096
00:36:41,109 --> 00:36:38,960
and i do a little uh demonstration of

1097
00:36:44,630 --> 00:36:41,119
that here when i traverse zero degrees

1098
00:36:46,550 --> 00:36:44,640
it goes up so i have to do a rotation of

1099
00:36:47,910 --> 00:36:46,560
the camera

1100
00:36:49,670 --> 00:36:47,920
quite a large rotation to actually

1101
00:36:52,630 --> 00:36:49,680
continue tracking

1102
00:36:54,310 --> 00:36:52,640
so it's complicated but it doesn't

1103
00:36:56,550 --> 00:36:54,320
require magic so if it doesn't require

1104
00:36:57,829 --> 00:36:56,560
magic it passes occam's razor we don't

1105
00:37:00,310 --> 00:36:57,839
have to add anything

1106
00:37:01,990 --> 00:37:00,320
and uh requiring mental gymnastics does

1107
00:37:03,750 --> 00:37:02,000
not qualify an explanation if the

1108
00:37:06,790 --> 00:37:03,760
explanation actually works

1109
00:37:08,390 --> 00:37:06,800
may be difficult but you can uh you can

1110
00:37:10,150 --> 00:37:08,400
make it work how do we convey it

1111
00:37:11,670 --> 00:37:10,160
how do i actually how do i get this

1112
00:37:13,510 --> 00:37:11,680
across keep it simple

1113
00:37:14,950 --> 00:37:13,520
not too simple don't don't hide away

1114
00:37:16,150 --> 00:37:14,960
from these complicated things like the

1115
00:37:18,470 --> 00:37:16,160
gimbal rotation

1116
00:37:20,150 --> 00:37:18,480
use visuals like i just did uh keep

1117
00:37:22,550 --> 00:37:20,160
refining the explanation if people don't

1118
00:37:25,430 --> 00:37:22,560
get it ask the internet and incorporate

1119
00:37:27,030 --> 00:37:25,440
new ideas and information because your

1120
00:37:28,069 --> 00:37:27,040
ideas will change and you need to be

1121
00:37:30,710 --> 00:37:28,079
flexible

1122
00:37:33,109 --> 00:37:30,720
and don't give up you will uh you will

1123
00:37:35,190 --> 00:37:33,119
get through to people if you keep trying

1124
00:37:36,950 --> 00:37:35,200
all right well thank you very much and

1125
00:37:38,790 --> 00:37:36,960
uh if we have time i guess i can take

1126
00:37:40,550 --> 00:37:38,800
questions

1127
00:37:42,310 --> 00:37:40,560
yeah no that was good with lots of time

1128
00:37:45,430 --> 00:37:42,320
for questions

1129
00:37:47,750 --> 00:37:45,440
um let me see i was looking for any

1130
00:37:49,990 --> 00:37:47,760
hands up

1131
00:37:52,310 --> 00:37:50,000
and the usual thing is if nobody asks

1132
00:37:55,349 --> 00:37:52,320
questions i have to ask something

1133
00:37:59,030 --> 00:37:55,359
to set the bar low all right

1134
00:37:59,510 --> 00:37:59,040
um we did get a there is a thing in the

1135
00:38:01,910 --> 00:37:59,520
chat

1136
00:38:02,950 --> 00:38:01,920
now from somebody who has their own ufo

1137
00:38:04,550 --> 00:38:02,960
experience

1138
00:38:06,950 --> 00:38:04,560
i mean i guess it's hard to answer

1139
00:38:11,109 --> 00:38:06,960
without investigating

1140
00:38:14,390 --> 00:38:11,119
is probably the answer yes indeed like

1141
00:38:17,190 --> 00:38:14,400
people's people's individual experiences

1142
00:38:19,270 --> 00:38:17,200
are often very personal and if they

1143
00:38:22,069 --> 00:38:19,280
don't have photographs or video

1144
00:38:23,990 --> 00:38:22,079
or images it's it's very hard to do

1145
00:38:26,470 --> 00:38:24,000
anything with a verbal description

1146
00:38:27,430 --> 00:38:26,480
and that's why i focus a lot on these

1147
00:38:29,510 --> 00:38:27,440
videos

1148
00:38:30,870 --> 00:38:29,520
uh people kind of say you know why don't

1149
00:38:33,750 --> 00:38:30,880
you why don't you

1150
00:38:34,310 --> 00:38:33,760
take the pilot's account into into

1151
00:38:36,470 --> 00:38:34,320
account

1152
00:38:38,150 --> 00:38:36,480
because people talk about having seen

1153
00:38:39,589 --> 00:38:38,160
things on the same day

1154
00:38:41,670 --> 00:38:39,599
but they didn't see what was actually in

1155
00:38:43,510 --> 00:38:41,680
the video so what i'm doing here is i'm

1156
00:38:46,550 --> 00:38:43,520
trying to explain what's in the video

1157
00:38:48,230 --> 00:38:46,560
and it's uh i'm not saying that this is

1158
00:38:51,430 --> 00:38:48,240
what everybody else saw

1159
00:38:54,310 --> 00:38:51,440
so this these videos being explained

1160
00:38:55,990 --> 00:38:54,320
doesn't actually disprove uh what any

1161
00:38:57,270 --> 00:38:56,000
one individual might have seen and it

1162
00:39:00,310 --> 00:38:57,280
certainly doesn't

1163
00:39:02,230 --> 00:39:00,320
explain all the ufos let alone the the

1164
00:39:05,910 --> 00:39:02,240
events of the uh

1165
00:39:09,829 --> 00:39:08,310
so i guess whale is asking how i mean

1166
00:39:11,910 --> 00:39:09,839
how ultimately how do you distinguish

1167
00:39:14,069 --> 00:39:11,920
between a hoax and an optical effect

1168
00:39:15,990 --> 00:39:14,079
i mean i guess what would really

1169
00:39:16,710 --> 00:39:16,000
convince you that it was a ufo i guess

1170
00:39:19,910 --> 00:39:16,720
is that

1171
00:39:23,510 --> 00:39:19,920
that it was aliens um well

1172
00:39:26,829 --> 00:39:23,520
i think the gold standard for science

1173
00:39:29,990 --> 00:39:26,839
is independently verifiable

1174
00:39:30,710 --> 00:39:30,000
um experiments that demonstrate or fail

1175
00:39:34,390 --> 00:39:30,720
to falsify

1176
00:39:38,069 --> 00:39:34,400
a hypothesis and with ufos

1177
00:39:41,990 --> 00:39:39,990
what you would like want to see ideally

1178
00:39:45,109 --> 00:39:42,000
is multiple cameras

1179
00:39:48,230 --> 00:39:45,119
from individuals who are not related

1180
00:39:50,150 --> 00:39:48,240
in any way uh sharing the same thing and

1181
00:39:51,270 --> 00:39:50,160
perhaps also like things like actual

1182
00:39:52,950 --> 00:39:51,280
radar data

1183
00:39:54,390 --> 00:39:52,960
in these cases people talk about the

1184
00:39:57,349 --> 00:39:54,400
there being radar data

1185
00:39:58,790 --> 00:39:57,359
but there isn't actually any data we can

1186
00:40:00,230 --> 00:39:58,800
look at there's just people saying oh i

1187
00:40:02,230 --> 00:40:00,240
remember being there at the time and i

1188
00:40:05,109 --> 00:40:02,240
saw these things on the radar

1189
00:40:06,069 --> 00:40:05,119
uh so yeah we want to have multiple sets

1190
00:40:12,470 --> 00:40:06,079
of data

1191
00:40:13,990 --> 00:40:12,480
somebody asking about conspiracy

1192
00:40:15,990 --> 00:40:14,000
enthusiasts so how do you

1193
00:40:17,589 --> 00:40:16,000
how do you i guess try to convince

1194
00:40:19,030 --> 00:40:17,599
somebody who doesn't seem to want to be

1195
00:40:22,630 --> 00:40:19,040
convinced

1196
00:40:24,630 --> 00:40:22,640
uh you talk to them

1197
00:40:25,910 --> 00:40:24,640
and you don't give up and you stay

1198
00:40:27,190 --> 00:40:25,920
polite

1199
00:40:29,510 --> 00:40:27,200
the most important thing to do with

1200
00:40:31,349 --> 00:40:29,520
anybody who is a conspiracy enthusiast

1201
00:40:34,790 --> 00:40:31,359
like say a q a non person

1202
00:40:38,150 --> 00:40:34,800
is to keep them grounded in reality

1203
00:40:39,990 --> 00:40:38,160
people often kind of lose lose

1204
00:40:40,950 --> 00:40:40,000
grasp of like what's real and what isn't

1205
00:40:42,630 --> 00:40:40,960
and they start getting all their

1206
00:40:44,630 --> 00:40:42,640
information from

1207
00:40:45,829 --> 00:40:44,640
a source or sources that are not very

1208
00:40:47,510 --> 00:40:45,839
good and

1209
00:40:48,870 --> 00:40:47,520
if you are talking to them now you might

1210
00:40:51,190 --> 00:40:48,880
be one of the few

1211
00:40:52,069 --> 00:40:51,200
sources of good information that's out

1212
00:40:53,670 --> 00:40:52,079
there so

1213
00:40:56,790 --> 00:40:53,680
even though you might not be able to

1214
00:40:59,190 --> 00:40:56,800
dissuade them from their strange beliefs

1215
00:41:00,710 --> 00:40:59,200
just keeping talking to them and talking

1216
00:41:02,309 --> 00:41:00,720
about things that are real and giving

1217
00:41:05,109 --> 00:41:02,319
them information that is real

1218
00:41:06,069 --> 00:41:05,119
in a nice non confrontational a nice

1219
00:41:08,150 --> 00:41:06,079
friendly way

1220
00:41:10,309 --> 00:41:08,160
that actually does have an effect it can